What word describes what you
think about Robert F. Kennedy Jr.? What word describes
what you think about
Robert F. Kennedy Jr.?
“Truly independent.”
Patrick, 45, Ariz., ind., white
“Outcast.”
Bruce, 32, Mass., Rep., Black
“Definitely different.”
Audra, 45, Wis., Dem., white
Opinion
America In Focus
Robert F. Kennedy Jr. didn’t make the cut for Thursday’s presidential debate, but he’s still a factor in the race, tapping into the skeptical, anti-establishment mood of many American voters. For our latest Times Opinion focus group, we wanted to explore the nature of Mr. Kennedy’s appeal to independent, Democratic and Republican voters who reflect a share of the electorate — unhappy with the Biden-Trump rematch, tired of politics, loosely informed about policy. Their curiosity about him shed light on what is and isn’t clicking in politics.
The 12 participants in the focus group saw the two major political parties as largely the same: fighting on behalf of the elites, out for themselves, not taking strong stances or being effective. (Abortion may be the biggest differentiator.) Many didn’t see either party as reflecting their views. Most saw President Biden as too old and Donald Trump as untrustworthy; when we asked what kind of car each would be, Mr. Biden was described as a Model T or an old Buick, and Mr. Trump was a car that had parts missing or was fancy looking but rusted out.
The voters intrigued by Mr. Kennedy seemed more likely to reflect Trumpist views — angry about establishment politics, immigration, government mandates and vaccination policies. A couple of people were opposed to Mr. Biden over the war in Gaza, calling it a genocide and him a murderer.
Some of Mr. Kennedy’s more controversial views — on vaccines and antidepressants — seemed to help him with these voters, as did the opposition to his candidacy by several of his relatives. His experience with addiction also gave him some relatability. Most of the participants didn’t think he would win in November, but they were hungry for an outspoken outsider who wasn’t Mr. Trump.
“You can disagree with Kennedy. I disagree with him on quite a few things. But he’s not hiding what his views are, the way that I feel Joe Biden is and Donald Trump is,” said Robert, a 29-year-old independent from Colorado. “They’re saying things to get elected. Robert F. Kennedy is saying things because he believes them.”
Patrick Healy, Margie Omero and Adrian J. Rivera
Mr. Healy is the deputy Opinion editor. Ms. Omero is a pollster. Mr. Rivera is an editorial assistant in Opinion.
Participants
Audra 45, Wisconsin, Democrat, white, job coach
Bruce 32, Massachusetts, Republican, Black, delivery driver
Erica 53, Missouri, independent, Black, van driver
Fatima 32, New Jersey, Democrat, Asian, clinical review coordinator
Henry 61, California, independent, white, business owner
Jackson 23, Alabama, Republican, white, medical assistant
Jessica 19, New Jersey, Democrat, white, student
Marc 55, Illinois, independent, white, independent contractor
Melanie 46, Kentucky, Democrat, Latina, educator
Melvin 30, Pennsylvania, independent, Black, project coordinator
Patrick 45, Arizona, independent, white, manufacturing engineer
Robert 29, Colorado, independent, white, program coordinator
Transcript
Moderator, Margie Omero
Fill in the blank. When I think about how things are going in the country right now, I’m most worried about: blank.
Melvin, 30, Pennsylvania, independent, Black, project coordinator
Lack of retaliation.
Robert, 29, Colorado, independent, white, program coordinator
Money in politics.
Jessica, 19, New Jersey, Democrat, white, student
Freedom.
Melanie, 46, Kentucky, Democrat, Latina, educator
The economy.
Marc, 55, Illinois, independent, white, independent contractor
Economy.
Audra, 45, Wisconsin, Democrat, white, job coach
Our planet dying.
Fatima, 32, New Jersey, Democrat, Asian, clinical review coordinator
The future.
Jackson, 23, Alabama, Republican, white, medical assistant
The future.
Bruce, 32, Massachusetts, Republican, Black, delivery driver
Illegal immigration.
Henry, 61, California, independent, white, business owner
The economy.
Patrick, 45, Arizona, independent, white, manufacturing engineer
The economy, including inflation, illegal immigration and drugs.
Erica, 53, Missouri, independent, Black, van driver
No good choices in choosing presidents this year.
Moderator, Margie Omero
Fatima and Jackson, you said “the future.”
Fatima, 32, New Jersey, Democrat, Asian, clinical review coordinator
I think the future encompasses all the specifics that people mentioned, from drugs to the economy.
Jackson, 23, Alabama, Republican, white, medical assistant
The two presidential options also don’t seem that fantastic. The nation isn’t really going to back either. So that’s really worrisome for the next five years.
Moderator, Margie Omero
What do you mean by the nation isn’t “going to back either” of them?
Jackson, 23, Alabama, Republican, white, medical assistant
There’s going to be an angry half against either, whoever is chosen. They’re going to be really loud and make it seem like we’re just not going to have a happy country.
Moderator, Margie Omero
Melvin, tell me what you mean by “lack of retaliation.”
Melvin, 30, Pennsylvania, independent, Black, project coordinator
Nobody’s standing up for themselves. Everyone’s just going along to get along. Your regular American doesn’t care to have a say so.
Moderator, Margie Omero
Can you give me an example?
Melvin, 30, Pennsylvania, independent, Black, project coordinator
Something as simple as taxes being raised on you. Everybody just says, “I’ll just pay it.”
Moderator, Margie Omero
What do you think about our current system of electing political leaders? If you think it should change, how?
Robert, 29, Colorado, independent, white, program coordinator
Politicians spend the majority of their time raising money for their next election, calling big donors and then having to serve those big donors’ interests. It happens regardless of party. We need to get the influence of that money out if we really want to see change for everyday Americans.
Moderator, Margie Omero
How would you change it?
Robert, 29, Colorado, independent, white, program coordinator
Publicly funded elections so every politician has the same amount that they can spend that’s allocated.
Jessica, 19, New Jersey, Democrat, white, student
I’m not a fan of the two-party system. There are many people that don’t necessarily fall exactly within either party but are forced to choose one over the other. I feel like that doesn’t put the right people in power; it just puts a person in power.
Moderator, Margie Omero
So what would you change?
Jessica, 19, New Jersey, Democrat, white, student
I would make it so that other candidates are viable candidates and have a genuine chance at running for office, as opposed to it just being another name on the ballot.
Marc, 55, Illinois, independent, white, independent contractor
I’m more concerned about election security at this point. Mail-in voting really troubled me. I thought there was a lot of shenanigans that took place in 2020. Do I wish there were more candidates? I mean, we have some third-party candidates that actually are getting a lot of attention. But unfortunately, they don’t have the funding to really make a serious run in this election.
Moderator, Margie Omero
How well do the two parties help you make sense of politics today?
Melanie, 46, Kentucky, Democrat, Latina, educator
At this point, we’re under the assumption that this certain party stands for this and so that person is automatically going to do what that party says.
Bruce, 32, Massachusetts, Republican, Black, delivery driver
I’ve come not to trust them very much at all. I think there’s so much animosity and that the way they present themselves is more like criticism of the other party. I try to make up my own mind. I don’t listen to it.
Moderator, Margie Omero
What kind of information are you thinking of when you’re like, “I don’t want to listen”?
Bruce, 32, Massachusetts, Republican, Black, delivery driver
Well, for example, what’s going on with the border — you really won’t get it from the mainstream media. You got a better chance with BBC America.
Patrick, 45, Arizona, independent, white, manufacturing engineer
Aside from the fringes, I kind of feel like they’re the same. They’re self-serving. They’re not standing up for what they believe in. It’s “How can I get re-elected?”
Do you think that the two parties are generally the same or generally different? Do you think that the two parties are generally the same or generally different?
Same
Fatima,32, N.J., Dem., Asian
Henry,61, Calif., ind., white
Marc,55, Ill., ind., white
Melvin,30, Pa., ind., Black
Patrick,45, Ariz., ind., white
Robert,29, Colo., ind., white
Different
Audra,45, Wis., Dem., white
Bruce,32, Mass., Rep., Black
Erica,53, Mo., ind., Black
Jackson,23, Ala., Rep., white
Jessica,19, N.J., Dem., white
Melanie,46, Ky., Dem., Latina
Bruce, 32, Massachusetts, Republican, Black, delivery driver
I think when it comes to foreign affairs, they support the same thing. They both want to give money in foreign aid. But domestically, they’re more likely to be different.
Henry, 61, California, independent, white, business owner
I don’t think either party has America’s best interests at heart. They all have their own agendas.
Audra, 45, Wisconsin, Democrat, white, job coach
Well, when it comes to money, the Republicans usually are more for the well-off and upper class. And Democrats lean toward some of the programs for the less advantaged people. But they still don’t really push anything really great through. All the student loan stuff, it never really happened. All the same people stay in power, I mean, other than the president. You have no new opinions, no new ideas, no new generations with different ideas.
Erica, 53, Missouri, independent, Black, van driver
Well, one is against abortion. One is for war, one is against war. One is for a border, one is not for a border. One wants to let some immigrants in, one doesn’t want to let immigrants in. They need to make their minds up.
Moderator, Margie Omero
Who’s “they”?
Erica, 53, Missouri, independent, Black, van driver
The presidents. They need to keep it simple, what they believe in, what they don’t believe in. Don’t throw dirt against each other. Just say what you believe in and just don’t worry about nobody else, like they used to back when I was 17, when I first started voting. Now? I just feel so sorry to vote in November now. I’m crying just thinking about it.
Is there a party that represents your views well? Is there a party that represents your views well? 1 person raised their hand.
Audra, 45, Wis., Dem., white
Bruce, 32, Mass., Rep., Black
Erica, 53, Mo., ind., Black
Fatima, 32, N.J., Dem., Asian
Henry, 61, Calif., ind., white
Jackson, 23, Ala., Rep., white
Jessica, 19, N.J., Dem., white
Marc, 55, Ill., ind., white
Melanie, 46, Ky., Dem., Latina
Melvin, 30, Pa., ind., Black
Patrick, 45, Ariz., ind., white
Robert, 29, Colo., ind., white
Jackson, 23, Alabama, Republican, white, medical assistant
I would say the Republican Party shares most of my views on abortion, foreign affairs, the economy. I wish that they were more accepting of the L.G.B.T.Q. community and transgender people.
Fatima, 32, New Jersey, Democrat, Asian, clinical review coordinator
For a long time, I thought the Democratic Party probably aligned with more of my views. But in the past year, with the genocide in Gaza and how much money we’re spending to fund killing innocent people across the world, I don’t think it matters who wins in the upcoming election. I think both parties are for killing innocent civilians for our own gain.
Moderator, Patrick Healy
Was there ever a time in your life when you felt one of the parties was closer to where your views are generally?
Robert, 29, Colorado, independent, white, program coordinator
Yeah, I would say in Obama’s first election, I thought the Democratic Party aligned really well with my views. But I’ve slowly come to find that there’s almost no difference on foreign issues. Both parties are parties of continuous war that Americans pay for. Obama increased the amount of wars that were happening abroad as well. That was really disappointing.
Moderator, Patrick Healy
With Obama’s first term, other than wars, was there anything that he or the Democratic Party was doing or saying that synched well with your views?
Robert, 29, Colorado, independent, white, program coordinator
Health care. Obamacare was a large push to overhaul health care in the United States. Now there’s no conversation about the fact that we have a chronic disease epidemic. We have severely obese children. We just had a pandemic where we were all locked indoors. Since Obamacare, there’s been no talk about “How do we make our country healthier? How do we get better access to health care?” And I used to think that that was the Democratic issue. We had a Democratically controlled Congress and president. There was no conversation about health care.
Jessica, 19, New Jersey, Democrat, white, student
On many moral and social issues, I tend to lean more Democratic. But over time, my faith in both parties has kind of decreased. As a young woman, I do worry when it comes to my reproductive rights. And that is one of the issues that I align more on with the Democratic Party. But on other issues, mostly economic issues, I tend to be somewhat in the middle.
Moderator, Patrick Healy
What changed in terms of economic issues or the economy that pushed you more toward the middle?
Jessica, 19, New Jersey, Democrat, white, student
The obvious one is inflation. I think that when you are having programs that cost a lot of money for the government to support, things automatically start to cost a little bit more for the average person.
Moderator, Margie Omero
Now we’re going to talk about different candidates running for president. The first is Joe Biden. What one word would you use to describe Joe Biden?
Jackson, 23, Alabama, Republican, white, medical assistant
Puppet.
Fatima, 32, New Jersey, Democrat, Asian, clinical review coordinator
Murderer.
Marc, 55, Illinois, independent, white, independent contractor
Corrupt.
Bruce, 32, Massachusetts, Republican, Black, delivery driver
Incompetent.
Audra, 45, Wisconsin, Democrat, white, job coach
I was actually going to say “puppet” as well.
Erica, 53, Missouri, independent, Black, van driver
Dementia.
Henry, 61, California, independent, white, business owner
Unfit.
Robert, 29, Colorado, independent, white, program coordinator
Incompetent.
Patrick, 45, Arizona, independent, white, manufacturing engineer
Puppet.
Melvin, 30, Pennsylvania, independent, Black, project coordinator
Joke.
Melanie, 46, Kentucky, Democrat, Latina, educator
Old.
Moderator, Margie Omero
The folks who said “puppet,” who is he a puppet of? Who’s pulling the strings?
Jackson, 23, Alabama, Republican, white, medical assistant
Democrats behind the scenes. I just doubt that anything that he’s saying is his own thoughts.
Fatima, 32, New Jersey, Democrat, Asian, clinical review coordinator
A lot of what he said, everybody else is telling him what to say. He doesn’t have a very strong personality.
Moderator, Margie Omero
Marc, you said “corrupt.”
Marc, 55, Illinois, independent, white, independent contractor
His son’s got a severe drug addiction. He was working for a Ukrainian power company. Why would a company want to have somebody on their board who knows nothing about energy on their board? And the answer is very obvious. It’s to have access to who they thought would possibly be in power in this country and to get influence.
Moderator, Margie Omero
Melvin, you said “joke.”
Melvin, 30, Pennsylvania, independent, Black, project coordinator
Well, he’s not even awake half the time. He can’t even read off his teleprompter. Are we serious?
Moderator, Margie Omero
If Joe Biden were a car, what kind of car would he be?
Erica, 53, Missouri, independent, Black, van driver
A Yugo.
Patrick, 45, Arizona, independent, white, manufacturing engineer
Rusted-out Buick. With flat tires.
Jessica, 19, New Jersey, Democrat, white, student
I kind of agree with the rusted-out Buick, to be honest with you.
Patrick, 45, Arizona, independent, white, manufacturing engineer
Old people love Buicks.
Melanie, 46, Kentucky, Democrat, Latina, educator
One of those Model T Fords.
Moderator, Margie Omero
Why did you pick that one?
Melanie, 46, Kentucky, Democrat, Latina, educator
Because there’s just something about being 80-something years old. I’m sure people can drive a Model T down the road, but that doesn’t mean it’s the most efficient car for the job or for the streets that we have right now.
Bruce, 32, Massachusetts, Republican, Black, delivery driver
A Ford Mustang. I once owned a Mustang, and it gave me nothing but trouble.
Robert, 29, Colorado, independent, white, program coordinator
I’d say a broken-down Jeep. Jeeps are supposed to be able to do a lot, but they’re super-unreliable. They break down. They kind of make a lot of promises, and they don’t last.
Marc, 55, Illinois, independent, white, independent contractor
Thinking about the Edsel? It’s supposed to be the worst car ever created.
Moderator, Margie Omero
Do you feel that way about Joe Biden? Do you feel that way compared with other presidents?
Marc, 55, Illinois, independent, white, independent contractor
He’s in the team photo. He might be the worst — definitely the worst in my lifetime.
Audra, 45, Wisconsin, Democrat, white, job coach
Old rusty station wagon.
Would you be more likely to consider voting for a Democrat running for president if Joe Biden weren’t the nominee? Would you be more likely to consider voting for a Democrat running for president if Joe Biden weren’t the nominee? 6 people raised their hands.
Audra, 45, Wis., Dem., white
Bruce, 32, Mass., Rep., Black
Erica, 53, Mo., ind., Black
Fatima, 32, N.J., Dem., Asian
Henry, 61, Calif., ind., white
Jackson, 23, Ala., Rep., white
Jessica, 19, N.J., Dem., white
Marc, 55, Ill., ind., white
Melanie, 46, Ky., Dem., Latina
Melvin, 30, Pa., ind., Black
Patrick, 45, Ariz., ind., white
Robert, 29, Colo., ind., white
Patrick, 45, Arizona, independent, white, manufacturing engineer
Well, I think there are other good Democratic candidates out there. But the machine is selecting who they want.
Moderator, Margie Omero
When you say there are other good Democrats, who are you thinking of?
Patrick, 45, Arizona, independent, white, manufacturing engineer
Most of the Democrats I like went independent. Tulsi Gabbard. Kyrsten Sinema from Arizona is someone who broke with her party. Joe Manchin. I mean, these people at least have a backbone. I would consider them over Biden.
Jessica, 19, New Jersey, Democrat, white, student
I would be more likely to vote for a Democratic candidate that was not 80-plus years old.
Audra, 45, Wisconsin, Democrat, white, job coach
I think a younger candidate would be a good thing, too.
Moderator, Patrick Healy
What’s one word you would use to describe Donald Trump?
Erica, 53, Missouri, independent, Black, van driver
A-hole.
Melanie, 46, Kentucky, Democrat, Latina, educator
Evil.
Melvin, 30, Pennsylvania, independent, Black, project coordinator
Charismatic.
Henry, 61, California, independent, white, business owner
Agenda.
Robert, 29, Colorado, independent, white, program coordinator
Incompetent.
Patrick, 45, Arizona, independent, white, manufacturing engineer
Charismatic but more on the bombastic side.
Marc, 55, Illinois, independent, white, independent contractor
I was going to say “bombastic.”
Bruce, 32, Massachusetts, Republican, Black, delivery driver
Undisciplined.
Jessica, 19, New Jersey, Democrat, white, student
Arrogant.
Jackson, 23, Alabama, Republican, white, medical assistant
Confident.
Fatima, 32, New Jersey, Democrat, Asian, clinical review coordinator
Senile. He’s crazy. “Grab the women by their vagin*s” or something? I don’t know how someone like that is charismatic, by any means.
Moderator, Patrick Healy
Jackson, what do you mean by “confident”?
Jackson, 23, Alabama, Republican, white, medical assistant
He’s confident about not just being a Republican. He kind of is his own thing.
Patrick, 45, Arizona, independent, white, manufacturing engineer
He’s loud. He’s brash. But he’s honestly the only person who’s stuck up for himself against both parties. Trump is a fighter, and he hits back.
Melvin, 30, Pennsylvania, independent, Black, project coordinator
He can say a lot of things and not really actually say anything, but you’ll come away liking it. You know what I’m saying?
Audra, 45, Wisconsin, Democrat, white, job coach
He’s a con artist. I didn’t think anything he said even made sense half the time. He was just the opposite of what America should be.
Moderator, Patrick Healy
If Donald Trump were a car, what kind of car would he be?
Erica, 53, Missouri, independent, Black, van driver
You know cars that you see in a junkyard that don’t have tires on them, and it’s just rusted out, and it’s been put in the crusher? That’s it.
Robert, 29, Colorado, independent, white, program coordinator
A car that looks really nice on the outside but the inside is all rusted out or it’s missing an engine.
Patrick, 45, Arizona, independent, white, manufacturing engineer
I would say a brightly colored limousine.
Melanie, 46, Kentucky, Democrat, Latina, educator
I think the car in the junkyard that’s got a whole lot of pieces missing, with maybe not all the wheels anymore and a busted-out windshield. And in the color orange.
Audra, 45, Wisconsin, Democrat, white, job coach
You remember that Stephen King movie “Christine”? A ’58 Plymouth.
Would you be more likely to consider voting for a Republican running for president if Donald Trump weren’t the nominee? Would you be more likely to consider voting for a Republican running for president if Donald Trump weren’t the nominee? 7 people raised their hands.
Audra, 45, Wis., Dem., white
Bruce, 32, Mass., Rep., Black
Erica, 53, Mo., ind., Black
Fatima, 32, N.J., Dem., Asian
Henry, 61, Calif., ind., white
Jackson, 23, Ala., Rep., white
Jessica, 19, N.J., Dem., white
Marc, 55, Ill., ind., white
Melanie, 46, Ky., Dem., Latina
Melvin, 30, Pa., ind., Black
Patrick, 45, Ariz., ind., white
Robert, 29, Colo., ind., white
Moderator, Margie Omero
What’s one word to describe what you think of when you think of Robert F. Kennedy Jr.?
Patrick, 45, Arizona, independent, white, manufacturing engineer
Truly independent.
Robert, 29, Colorado, independent, white, program coordinator
Principled.
Erica, 53, Missouri, independent, Black, van driver
Trump-like.
Marc, 55, Illinois, independent, white, independent contractor
Anti-establishment.
Bruce, 32, Massachusetts, Republican, Black, delivery driver
Outcast.
Jessica, 19, New Jersey, Democrat, white, student
I’m not sure.
Audra, 45, Wisconsin, Democrat, white, job coach
Definitely different from everybody else.
Fatima, 32, New Jersey, Democrat, Asian, clinical review coordinator
Not sure.
Jackson, 23, Alabama, Republican, white, medical assistant
Same.
Moderator, Margie Omero
Robert, you said “principled.”
Robert, 29, Colorado, independent, white, program coordinator
You can disagree with Kennedy. I disagree with him on quite a few things. But he’s not hiding what his views are, the way that I feel Joe Biden is and Donald Trump is. They’re saying things to get elected. Robert F. Kennedy is saying things because he believes them.
Moderator, Margie Omero
From folks who said they’re not sure, I want to hear a little bit more.
Fatima, 32, New Jersey, Democrat, Asian, clinical review coordinator
I refuse to vote for Biden or Trump. So I’m going to give it to a third party. It doesn’t really matter who they are, unfortunately.
Jackson, 23, Alabama, Republican, white, medical assistant
I like what he has to say about vaccines and health care and everything, but I just don’t know. I just don’t know about every single one of his policies and would like to see him, especially, debate Trump and Biden.
Jessica, 19, New Jersey, Democrat, white, student
There is a lot of hype surrounding him. So that kind of automatically intrigued me. But I haven’t really had the chance to fully form an opinion yet.
Moderator, Margie Omero
If R.F.K. Jr. were a car, what kind of car would he be?
Audra, 45, Wisconsin, Democrat, white, job coach
Prius.
Henry, 61, California, independent, white, business owner
A Honda Civic.
Melanie, 46, Kentucky, Democrat, Latina, educator
Kind of like a Ford Focus. I mean, they’re going to get you from here to there, but I’m not seeing any sports-car-type qualities yet. But I’m also not seeing the junkyard.
Erica, 53, Missouri, independent, Black, van driver
A Tesla in 20-below-degree weather, when the cars didn’t work. He reminded me of Trump. I was in his corner until I found out about his beliefs. His own family doesn’t even support him.
Bruce, 32, Massachusetts, Republican, Black, delivery driver
I was just going to say I think he’s like a self-driving car. They make me uncomfortable. But he’s probably not as unsafe as you think.
Moderator, Margie Omero
Marc, what questions do you have about R.F.K. Jr.?
Marc, 55, Illinois, independent, white, independent contractor
If it were just a binary choice between him or Biden, I would easily go R.F.K. Jr. I don’t know if I fully embrace all his policies, but I respect the guy in that he doesn’t think with the hive mind, especially when it came to Covid and the vaccines, as well as the weaponization of government and the deep state.
Robert, 29, Colorado, independent, white, program coordinator
I had the concern of him being a Kennedy and growing up in this superwealthy lifestyle. I thought that he would not be a defender of the Everyman. But then I learned a little bit about his life, his struggle with addiction, the fact that he lost his father tragically. And I actually began to relate to him a lot more than I thought I would, not being a millionaire myself.
Moderator, Margie Omero
What do you see as what R.F.K. stands for? Who do you see him fighting for?
Jessica, 19, New Jersey, Democrat, white, student
I haven’t done a terrible amount of research. But I would say I have more confidence that he would fight for the average citizen, as opposed to always doing what is in the best interest of a party.
Patrick, 45, Arizona, independent, white, manufacturing engineer
I think he would fight against Big Pharma and Medical, being someone who opposed the vaccines. Even with his voice thing, I think he’s seeking out natural remedies. And that’s something that I can get on board with.
Moderator, Margie Omero
A few people have mentioned R.F.K. Jr.’s position on vaccines. Is that something that people like? Does anybody say, “I’m not sure what people are referring to”?
Patrick, 45, Arizona, independent, white, manufacturing engineer
I wouldn’t say he’s anti-vax. I think he’s pro-choice when it comes to vaccines. I think Republicans and Democrats are “You shall get this Covid vaccine.” We don’t know what it does. And you know, you look back on it and say, “Well, hell, a lot of people got the vax, and they still got Covid.”
Moderator, Margie Omero
I have a quote here from him where it says there is “no vaccine that is safe and effective.”
Patrick, 45, Arizona, independent, white, manufacturing engineer
I believe that 100 percent. My wife and I were looking into it.
Fatima, 32, New Jersey, Democrat, Asian, clinical review coordinator
I’m pro-vax. I think it’s something that we need. And obviously, once we’ve gotten the vaccine, the Covid rate has gone down. And even if people have gotten sick, they’ve gotten less sick. I just don’t agree with people who don’t agree to get vaccines.
Moderator, Margie Omero
Let me read you how R.F.K. Jr. describes himself. “Independent of the broken two-party system and the corporate corruption of our government, R.F.K. Jr. will pursue new policies in the best interests of the American people. He believes people who work hard should be able to afford a good life.” What do people think of that?
Henry, 61, California, independent, white, business owner
I think he’s right-on, and I do agree with him. And I feel that the other candidates should also learn from him. They have their own agendas.
Audra, 45, Wisconsin, Democrat, white, job coach
After this group, I think I have made up my mind who I’m going to vote for. Because I think voting for somebody is better than voting for nobody at all.
Moderator, Margie Omero
So what did you hear that made you feel you’re going to change your mind?
Audra, 45, Wisconsin, Democrat, white, job coach
With the addictions and his father passing away, he just had a lot of things that a lot of presidents don’t go through. They’re pretty silver-spooned and privileged. And even with those privileges, he’s experienced a lot of tragedies. He’s for the environment and all different things. He’s just very open. You know what I mean? Just seems different. And maybe it is like the Manchurian candidate, but maybe it’s not, and it couldn’t be any worse than Trump, I don’t think. I would hope.
Erica, 53, Missouri, independent, Black, van driver
I still don’t know who I’m going to vote for. I was for Kennedy until I found out about some of his beliefs I didn’t care for.
Moderator, Margie Omero
Most of R.F.K. Jr.’s family has endorsed Joe Biden, like Erica said earlier. What do people think of that?
Robert, 29, Colorado, independent, white, program coordinator
Well, I think it makes sense. It seems like they’re benefiting from the broken system. So why would they get rid of it?
Bruce, 32, Massachusetts, Republican, Black, delivery driver
Exactly.
Jackson, 23, Alabama, Republican, white, medical assistant
It sounds like Trump. He’s not swayed, even if people are close to him and believe this other thing.
Jessica, 19, New Jersey, Democrat, white, student
I think it almost gives me a little bit more faith in him and his ability to potentially run a country.
Moderator, Margie Omero
Why is that?
Jessica, 19, New Jersey, Democrat, white, student
Being able to stand up for what you personally believe in and what you think is best for the country and what you think is right, even if the people around you and the people who are supposed to support you don’t agree with that, I think is an important quality to have in a candidate.
Moderator, Margie Omero
Does the fact that most of R.F.K. Jr.’s family has endorsed Joe Biden make you more or less supportive of R.F.K. Jr.?
Fatima, 32, New Jersey, Democrat, Asian, clinical review coordinator
It doesn’t mean anything to me. Because I feel like they’re probably doing it for their own political gain.
Moderator, Patrick Healy
I want to run quickly through a few other things that R.F.K. Jr. has said, just to see if they make any kind of strong impact on you or not. He said the events at the Capitol on Jan. 6 did not meet the definition of an insurrection. And I’m curious if that makes you any more or less likely to kind of lean his way.
Fatima, 32, New Jersey, Democrat, Asian, clinical review coordinator
He sounds crazy.
Erica, 53, Missouri, independent, Black, van driver
I agree with her.
Marc, 55, Illinois, independent, white, independent contractor
I agree with R.F.K. Jr.’s assessment that it does not qualify as an insurrection. You may not like Trump or his followers, but to me, an insurrection means you have a real shot of taking over a country with powerful backing and army weaponry. You can call it trespassing. You can call it a lot of things, but that is not an insurrection.
Fatima, 32, New Jersey, Democrat, Asian, clinical review coordinator
They didn’t have weapons with them when they entered?
Marc, 55, Illinois, independent, white, independent contractor
Most of them were unarmed, as far as I know. And there were Capitol Police that were basically waving them in, and they were warned, like, the day before, that there was going to be activity in Washington.
Moderator, Patrick Healy
I want to go to another comment, about school shootings. R.F.K. Jr. has suggested that antidepressants have led to an increase in school shootings.
Bruce, 32, Massachusetts, Republican, Black, delivery driver
He seems to think that America is just generally overmedicated, so he opposes any type of unnecessary medication.
Jessica, 19, New Jersey, Democrat, white, student
I don’t necessarily know if he’s qualified to make statements like that, and I think it does raise some questions that his views and opinions may not entirely be backed by research or backed by people who are experts in those areas.
Melanie, 46, Kentucky, Democrat, Latina, educator
It seems a little sus. I don’t see the correlation between what causes a person or a child to find a gun and enter a school building come together with the use of an antidepressant.
Moderator, Patrick Healy
Can I ask the folks who said the economy and inflation mattered a great deal to them earlier in the discussion — do any of you see R.F.K. Jr. having any ideas related to the economy or inflation that appeal to you or don’t?
Henry, 61, California, independent, white, business owner
I haven’t heard anything, actually.
Audra, 45, Wisconsin, Democrat, white, job coach
Yeah, me either.
Erica, 53, Missouri, independent, Black, van driver
To me, the economy is booming. So I’m trying to figure out what they’re talking about. There’s too many jobs out here. A lot of people don’t want to work.
Moderator, Patrick Healy
Do you think R.F.K. Jr. could win the presidential election in November?
Audra, 45, Wisconsin, Democrat, white, job coach
I think anything’s possible. Trump won.
Moderator, Margie Omero
Many people would call R.F.K. Jr. a spoiler. Most people don’t think he’ll win, but it would mean that Trump or Biden would win. How would that make you feel?
Melanie, 46, Kentucky, Democrat, Latina, educator
I mean, if I voted for him wholeheartedly, then whatever the outcome is, we have to work with it. What choice do we have, you know?
Erica, 53, Missouri, independent, Black, van driver
To me, we ain’t really got a choice. We only got three people, and we just got to vote for one of them. The outcome is not going to be pretty.
Moderator, Margie Omero
Audra, you’re from a battleground state. So tell me, do you think about who might win your state and how that impacts how you’re going to vote in this race?
Audra, 45, Wisconsin, Democrat, white, job coach
One of the things is I never understood what the electoral votes are. Sometimes it does feel like, why vote? Really, it’s up to people who aren’t us. They’re not us people with the low incomes and the medium incomes. And we need funding and services and schools.
Moderator, Margie Omero
OK. Patrick, you live in a battleground state. Tell me, how much are you going to be thinking, “OK, I need to decide how I’m going to vote based on who might win my state”?
Patrick, 45, Arizona, independent, white, manufacturing engineer
I basically vote on what’s going to benefit my family and my neighbors the most. Because that’s who I look out for first and foremost. If a vote for Kennedy changes the outcome unfavorably, that’s something I’m definitely looking at.
Jackson, 23, Alabama, Republican, white, medical assistant
Well, I live in Alabama. So it’s not a battleground. But if it were, then I wouldn’t vote for R.F.K., because I’m too concerned about a certain candidate winning.
Moderator, Margie Omero
If you could ask R.F.K. Jr. any question and he had to answer it honestly — he had taken truth serum — what would you ask him?
Henry, 61, California, independent, white, business owner
Well, how many times have you done drugs? It shows the character of the person.
Jessica, 19, New Jersey, Democrat, white, student
I would ask: If he had to throw his weight behind one of the other two candidates, which one would he wholeheartedly throw his weight behind?
Robert, 29, Colorado, independent, white, program coordinator
I’d ask what his plan is for the Israel-Palestine conflict. I think I’d be really interested in that supernuanced problem, but I would love to hear his take on it because we’re getting the same thing from the other two candidates.
Moderator, Margie Omero
What do you think his answer would be?
Robert, 29, Colorado, independent, white, program coordinator
I think that he was for a two-state solution. I still think that he’s not as pro-Palestinian as I’d wish he would be.
Regardless of whom you’ll vote for, who do you think will win the 2024 presidential election? Regardless of whom you’ll vote for, who do you think will win the 2024 presidential election?
Joe Biden
Audra,45, Wis., Dem., white
Jackson,23, Ala., Rep., white
Melvin,30, Pa., ind., Black
Donald Trump
Bruce,32, Mass., Rep., Black
Erica,53, Mo., ind., Black
Fatima,32, N.J., Dem., Asian
Henry,61, Calif., ind., white
Jessica,19, N.J., Dem., white
Marc,55, Ill., ind., white
Melanie,46, Ky., Dem., Latina
Patrick,45, Ariz., ind., white
Robert F. Kennedy
Robert,29, Colo., ind., white
Moderator, Patrick Healy
Is there anything that Biden or Trump or R.F.K. Jr. could say or do that would absolutely solidify you voting for any of them?
Patrick, 45, Arizona, independent, white, manufacturing engineer
I think if Trump were to make himself more human and apologize for a lot of the things that he’s caused —
Melanie, 46, Kentucky, Democrat, Latina, educator
Oh, he will never do that.
Patrick, 45, Arizona, independent, white, manufacturing engineer
I know. Then I would vote for him. And I just agree that that would never happen, which is a problem. But if he did, then I would.
Audra, 45, Wisconsin, Democrat, white, job coach
I might, too, if he did. But we know that’s never going to happen.
Robert, 29, Colorado, independent, white, program coordinator
Biden has the power to put in policy. If he started removing corporate capture, he started getting rid of lobbyists, if he ended the funding of foreign wars, the genocide in Gaza, it’d be pretty easy to get my vote.
Moderator, Patrick Healy
Marc, how about you?
Marc, 55, Illinois, independent, white, independent contractor
I’d want to know where R.F.K. Jr. stands on the economy and the endless printing of money and the $34 trillion that we’re in debt right now and what he would want to see done differently. And I would also want to know where he stood on border security.
Erica, 53, Missouri, independent, Black, van driver
I feel if Trump’s mouth is moving, he’s lying. I just don’t trust him as far as I can throw him.
Melanie, 46, Kentucky, Democrat, Latina, educator
I can’t believe they even let him be a candidate. It’s crazy. He should be in prison.
Bruce, 32, Massachusetts, Republican, Black, delivery driver
I would just like to hear them speak with the same passion about illegal immigration and money in politics as they do about giving money to Ukraine or Israel. Being a nativist isn’t a bad thing.
